Worldwide Ayn Rand Meetup Message Board › Who is the real life Howard Roark and John Galt?

Who is the real life Howard Roark and John Galt?

A former member
Posted Jun 13, 2005 5:55 AM
Post #: 22
Somebody is got to be the man of the highest mind in the entire human race.Is he the real life Roark and Galt?Ayn Rand
takes the name of Prometheus from Greece who lived about
ten thousand years ago.We all know about the tremendous creative
capacity of Prometheus.[He taught men how to build the first homes,
how to extract metals from the ores,a convenient method for making fire,domesticating the wild animals and everything that the first men of our kind had to do for the first time.]
But what about the tremendous warrior capacity of Ram and the
tremendous capacity of Krishna to enjoy his life?Ayn Rand did not
know about Ram and Krishna,did she?
Was Ram the Immediate Rebirth of Prometheus?
A former member
Posted Jun 14, 2005 8:06 AM
Post #: 25
Sumit - You are juggling between standards like creative capacity,
warrior capacity,capacity to enjoy one's life,intelligence capacity,
real life etc.When you define each one of the above terms you will
get the answer for your question.smile
A former member
Posted Jun 15, 2005 4:48 AM
Post #: 28
The man of the highest mind would obviously demonstrate the
highest capacity in any work that he chooses to do in his lifetime
whether it is inventions,wars,philosophy or sexual capacity.
The scientists have worked out a probability that for your parents to give birth to another child with the same genes as yours they
would have to visit the maternity ward for another million billion
times.But they also say that no two individual can have the same
level of intelligence.Otherwise they would be one and the same person!Your parents can pass you a million to tenth of a million
charecteristics[gene combinations] without altering your intelligence
level.Thus the maximum number of unique individuals possible in
the human race is anywhere between 1 billion to 10 billion.
What is interesting is here.When the world population reaches
10 billion we can expect every possible human being to be living at
the same time on this earth!The current world population is 6.5 billion and is expected to reach 9.1 billion by 2050.
So is Ayn Rand coming back in the next 100 years?

It is the legends of Prometheus,Ram and Krishna which
look like that of Howard Roark's and John Galt's in the ancient times.
To assume that the highest man has done nothing in the last ten
thousand years of mankind's existence or that he is yet to be born,
would amount to contradicting the philosophy explained in
Atlas Shrugged!The man of the highest mind would never leave the world in the hands of his enemies!Ayn Rand would have been proud of Krishna's acts!
A former member
Posted Jun 17, 2005 5:46 AM
Post #: 30
Sagar - The boy says the belief in rebirths of individuals amounts to irrationalism - the endless life cycles and death,you
see!He says that we human beings might be intelligent but it is
our own morality,standards and premises which guide us.That
nurture vs. nature is still in the 3:2 ratio so we who have
humungous number of brain cells [they vary from individual to
individual,you see!] with zero conviction[since sagar has so less of them]! we can never be sure as to the type of human being that arises etc.And that where is your John Galt?So it would be sure folly to assume that when 10 billions arise there would be
another john galt or ayn rand or ram or krishna or prometheus
or david or whatever!
But... but the idea is interesting and exciting nonetheless!laughing
A former member
Posted Jun 17, 2005 8:25 AM
Post #: 32
But what about the first two basic laws of the universe - the first axiom that existence exists,it was always there and will always be there.And the law of identity which states that A is A!

If an Ayn Rand has existed then that is proof of the fact that she will always come back!And that is what is wrong with the moral
code of mankind that nurture is against nature.Nurture,the way you raise up a man should be according to his nature and not against
it!smile You ask where is your John Galt?The answer is who is Krishna?smile
A former member
Posted Jun 20, 2005 7:26 AM
Post #: 34
Sagar -
And as existence exists non existence does not exist.
A is A and Ayn Rand is Ayn Rand.But she is dead now and is gone
and so according to Sagar she will never be back!smile

Myself - [And that is my point!Our conscioussness is such a beautiful thing that we always notice or grasp our existence only!
We are incapable of noticing our non-existence,the gaps in between
our different lifetimes!So as far as my conscioussness is concerned,
same for everybody else, I am always there!It is a single continuos and perpetual state of existence which I am aware of and nothing else!]
I am born, I am a kid to begin with,I grow up to be old and then
I die and then I am born again and the same process goes for
ad infinitum!
Never ending state of existence that is! Isn't it
wonderful?Well, if you don't feel that way[wonderful about it,that is!], then don't blame me!I am not responsible for it!smile ]
But it will change for the better soon.
A former member
Posted Jun 26, 2005 11:22 AM
Post #: 3
Well,nurture does play a role in the
making of a man!Observe the contrast in the character of Roark and Galt.Yet Ayn claims that they are
one and the same person - the man of the highest mind.And observe the contrast in the Ram and Krishna also!
If one uses the exact definition of
an Individual one can easily prove that reincarnation is true and assuming otherwise leads to conclusions not observed in reality.
A person is defined by his unique
level of intelligence.That is no other
person has exactly the same level of
intelligence.Ask the scientists!
So if we assume that reincarnation
is not true then we arrive at the
possibility that Multiciplity [the same person can have different
identities and intelligence in his different births.] or infinity [infinite
number of individuals with different
intelligence level are possible.] is
true!
In either case what happens is this - We can always have a man
with infinite level of intelligence,that is,there is simply no limit to his intelligence!Why?Since existence exists there are infinite births of all
living creatures is possible!
A man with infinite intelligence
has never been observed thus far
and it will never happen either!
This argument easily shows that
when a person with the same intelligence is born again he has been
in fact reincarnated!smile
A former member
Posted Jun 27, 2005 5:13 AM
Post #: 4
Sagar-
Of what use is intelligence without the morals to
guide it?Thats my point!What is the validity of your questions?
So who is your man of highest intelligence? [He is asking this
question after I have answered it!]
A former member
Posted Jun 27, 2005 5:16 AM
Post #: 5
Sumit -
Before any further discussion it would be better if you both agree on the defintion of intelligence and what is the source of it.Whether it is gene-controlled or free will!
A former member
Posted Jun 27, 2005 5:21 AM
Post #: 6
To qoute Ayn Rand - 'No matter what is the innate degree of
man's intelligence he has to develop his ability to use it or else
he merely becomes a transitional creature'.
So Intelligence is endowed by nature but man is free to
use it or not!
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