SOLO changed name of all Ayn Rand Meetup groups around the world?

It appears that a promoter for SOLO used Meetup.com to join local Meetups far from his home and invite them to fly the SOLO banner (Sense of Life Objectivists). Meetups around the country now appear to affiliated with SOLO.

As a new local Meetup Organizer, I briefly checked out the SOLO link and questioned whether our local group should be affiliated with SOLO or any national organization. SOLO appears to be a relatively new organization antagonistic to both ARI (The Ayn Rand Institute) and TOC (The Objectivist Center), which appear to already be antagonist to each other. See my previous posts to our local group.

What do you think?



7-12-09 NOTE:
I would have deleted this thread long ago, if I could. I edited the title to make it less inflammatory and my own posts to remove personal names. I was new to meetup at the time and have more perspective now.
-- Old Toad

Howdy,

I do indeed seek to promote SOLO within the Ayn Rand Meetup community. To this end, I posted a SOLO JPG file to the Photos section of any Ayn Rand Meetup that permitted it. This was simply to bring SOLO to the attention of the many Ayn Rand Meetups that take place across the globe.

Those Meetups that lack a committed Organizer can fly the SOLO banner de facto until such time as a Member decides to step up to the plate as an Organizer and decide otherwise.

I have posted elsewhere that the benefits of flying the SOLO banner include free Web space on the SOLO Web site at http://www.solohq.com... as well as a chance to network with other like minded people. I have yet to see another Objectivist organization that hits the right synergistic integration of reason and passion to surpass SOLO.

I did not leave your particular Meetup because of your post, but only because I already have plenty of Meetups on my plate to occupy me.

Please consider giving SOLO a careful look and ponder the benefits of associating with our organization.


Luke Setzer

Hello,
Ayn Rand never said that intelligence is the monopoly of geniuses!
But the world should belong to the high level geniuses.Only then life will be exciting on this earth.Otherwise people will die of BOREDOM!
Ayn's view of human nature is that of Man worshippers.If Roark and Galt
are the fiction versions of that then Pro,Ram and Kris are the real life versions
of that.
Objectivism is a closed system as for as its fundamentals are concerned!
If you question them then you are on the wrong side.

I respectfully suggest that he reconsider his strategy for promoting SOLO and that he take the necessary steps to correct the trespass on other local meetups.

A visitor to a foreign meetup should not feel free to to unilaterally hoist a banner of alliance. Merely because a local meetup does not have an active organizer, which makes such action technically possible, does not make it welcome or appropriate. Just because no one is minding a local store does not make it his store.

His action is also misleading in the marketplace of ideas because his uninvited actions make it appear that numerous local meetups around the country have independently considered an affiliation with SOLO and judged the link appropriate. In addtion to making an illogical appeal to SOLO's apparent popularity, it also is deceptive as to the actual lack of popularity of SOLO among the Ayn Rand meetups. The reality is it's just him.

Finally, his action santions retaliatory and other similar behaviour. For example, would it be appropriate for anyone, through the openness of the meetup structure, to go around the country changing names of Ayn Rand meetups that don't have an active organizer and affiliate them with a religious club?

He appears to be intelligent and well intentioned, and I regret that he is so far away that we cannot meet personally at a local meetup. But his unilateral and uninvited action has given offense to at least a few members of our local meetup in North Texas.

(I also regret the lack of civility of one of the members of our local meetup in response to his actions, and I am also asking him to reconsider his words.)

ARI,TOC and SOLO - The number is too few and not too many,isn't it?
ARI AND TOC want to advance Objectivism!But what is there to be advanced
in objectivism?But they are all nice.

I'd like to thank Todd for informing all of the other meetup.com
groups of Luther Setzer's actions. I know like many of you it is hard to build any group of OUR KIND. We need as few stumbling blocks as we can get in building & keeping our groups. As a member of
N.T.O.S. ( North Texas Objectivists Society ) where Todd is the Organizer. We have our work cut out for us as it is. With one simple goal in mind. Meeting like-minded individuals for fun and education. So anyone is welcome to help with good ideas. Yet coming in and making it appear that we endorse SOLO, ARI, or TOC without our knowledge or consent. I take this to be very un-Rand like behavior, for lack of a better term. As I am sure all of the above groups are wonderful, any of us could learn something good from all of those groups. Let us decide if we will endorse any of these not you decide for us. To all, I hope you have a wonderful day, and many happy days in the future.


Jamie

Here in Chicago we are considering affiliating with Solo. I personally think it is a wonderful idea. Solo is a huge international objectivist community comprised of well over a thousand members all over the world. Sure, some members are anti-ARI or anti-TOC and some are even anti-Solo...but we are all objectivists at heart. The group leans a bit towards TOC but all objectivists are welcome to join. Its like a big objectivist family, crazy uncles and all. And, no, I don't consider Luke to be one of the crazy uncles.

A while back I posted a question about the TOC/ARI/Solo issue. Here is a link to that thread. http://solohq.com/For...

Luther Setzer has done a fantastic job of building his group in Florida by bringing people of various groups together for the purpose of advancing the philosophy of objectivism. That, IMO is a good thing. Thanks Luke.

Kat,

Thank you! I deeply appreciate your moral support!




Luke Setzer

Kat,

One issue is whether a local meetup should affiliate with ARI, TOC, or SOLO. The other issue is whether he should reconsider a few of his strategies for promoting SOLO, including actions such as "joining" local meetups everywhere in the world, unilaterlay changing the names of local meetups around the world, and unilaterally hoisting the SOLO banner over local meetups around the world.

Regarding the first issue, if the size of the membership is the standard, I believe ARI and TOC each are much, much larger than SOLO. I do not know which is the largest, however.

Aside from which might be largest, and for whatever that may be worth, what are the benefits for a local meetup or club to affiliate with any of these?

ARI does not appear to support or help community groups whatsoever. It prefers to promote Objectivism primarily through high school and college clubs and with essay scholarship contests. It does not want local clubs to confuse what ARI considers Objectivism to be. It appears, however, that ARI should be credited with making Ayn Rand's books required reading in many high schools and universities, which is incredibly important work that we should each individually consider supporting.

TOC does help community groups organize and find other like-minded persons in a local area, but does not otherwise support, endorse, or attempt to control local clubs, whatsoever. But ARI accuses TOC of promoting a gross distortion of Objectivism, and in response TOC accuses ARI of being dogmatic. Personally, I don't yet understand the debate. But it does appear that with little or no support from ARI, people interested in having a local community have had little option (at least until SOLO) but to go through TOC, which has created a defacto base for TOC among community groups. Even though TOC does not otherwise support or endorse local clubs, if a local club even lists its presence on the TOC website, however, it is likely to alienate at least some ARI supporters.

SOLO appears highly antagonistic to both ARI and TOC, but it appears philosophically aligned with TOC. SOLO accuses ARI of too dogmatic (the same as TOC's complaint with ARI). SOLOs accuses TOC of being not active enough and not judgmental enough. On the other hand, SOLO claims it is trying to bridge differences (which may be unbridgable). It appears that the only difference between TOC and SOLO is a debate over how best to promote what they consider to be Objectivism (to the bitter disagreement of ARI). What are the advantages for a local group to affiliate with SOLO? It will offer the club a bit of webspace. Meetup.com does the same thing, for free. What are the disadvantages? It is likely to alienate at least some ARI and TOC supporters.

So what is the reality of having a local club associate itself with ARI, TOC, or SOLO? Little or no benefit, and a good chance of alienating people in the area we would like to have a chance to meet.

I suggest that local clubs leave the issue to be studied by and among their individual local members. Each individual must study and learn the issues for him or herself, cannot take it on faith or authority from anyone, and ultimately should come to an independent conclusion. Until the happy day when we do have sufficient thousands of persons within a metro area who are interested in Objectivism, we probably cannot afford to split local meetups along such lines before we even have a chance to meetup.

The second issue remains. Whether or not you support SOLO, should he reconsider his strategies of "joining" local meetups everywhere in the world, unilaterlay changing the names of local meetups around the world, and unilaterally hoisting the SOLO banner over local meetups around the world?

Kat, why do you strongly suggest your meetup (and others) affiliate with SOLO? Are you aware that there is a long- standing, active club in the Chicago area, i.e., http://www.bomis.com/... (some of whose members individually are TOC supporters)? Do you want to risk alientating them by hoisting the SOLO banner? And why do you support his strategy for promoting SOLO among local meetups?

I would like to meet him. But I still respectfully question what SOLO is about, the benefits of associating as a local club with SOLO (or the others), and a few of his strategies.

What do other people out there think about all this?

I'm unfortunately too far away to be involved in your American meetups, but I would like to step in with a few positive words of support for SOLO and Luther Setzer.

Those that are interested in finding out about SOLO can read its credo at http://www.solohq.com... .

I cannot summarise the essence of the SOLO project better than SOLO's founders do in this short, inspiring call to action. I have loved the site since its conception and am constantly uplifted by those who participate in the lively forums and constantly updated content. It is in the nature of SOLO to step out and act, and for that I commend Luther for his purposeful approach to making objectivism a part of his life and that of others.

For me, that activity and energy gives him the moral "right" to place flags in unclaimed meetups, with the proviso that anyone is free to claim back those meetups should they bring to the table as much action and passion as Mr. Setzer. The very fact that we are debating this issue is a positive sign, in my mind, given the thousands of dormant Randites out there who are playing Mr. Incredible in their cubicles, oblivious to the possibility that objectivism can be a living, breathing reality, and not just a passing fad, a floating abstraction dead forever inside the musty pages of Atlas Shrugged.

Good on you Luke.